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Right to Bare Arms

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Offline Alfie

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Offline Bear

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Alfie you are 100% right and also we should have not stuck our nose in Europe in 1940, also look up how many countries are in Afghanistan it is not just America, how about Egypt who was in that? That is a poor argument. I still have not heard any discussion about Thailand and other countries that allow people to have guns you are all focused on one country Why?  I have never heard of someone wanting to kill someone go get a permit? People will get what ever they want guns, bombs, knives and many other things to kill  people. look all the human bombs they are used everyday kill many more people then hand guns in the US !!!!! But no  DISCUSSION about them only if happens in the US. How many of you are anti American ? Bear  (just disscussing the facts)
If you want to make the world a better place take a look at yourself and then make a change.


Offline sulasno

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I had contemplated on getting a gun in Thailand but was advised against it;
Guns are not for hot headed people ...............

Why are many Asians anti American ? (the administration not the people)
Simple answer; because the Americans stick their noses in everything (when it is none of their business)

Guess who were part of the recent coup in Thailand ?

It is very obvious that the Americans (the administration and not the people) are afraid of China and hence wants to involve herself in the East


Offline sulasno

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Offline Jeff1

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Fun little thread eh Alfie?
I have to say, it did help me make up my mind about some members.


Offline Alfie

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Bear, I think you are missing my point. I will make it clearer if that's the case. The argument about the US not being in Afghanistan was just an example using the same logic as in Thairanger's argument - "nothing to do with you so keep your nose out". It is not my argument. It is what you and Thairanger are arguing.

However, it now seems that you believe that foreigners should sometimes get involved in the affairs of other countries. Surely that extends to discussing (only discussing) guns and laws.

The OP was started by Toddy. I imagine it was triggered by news of the shooting yesterday - in the US. Personally, I don't think that shooting was a big deal but Toddy obviously wanted to extend the discussion to the right to bare arms.

By all means start a new topic about human bombs (or any other topic) if that's what you want. I won't tell you not to discuss it just because it didn't happen in your country. That would be the height of arrogance.

Finally, why do you assume or suggest that people who do not agree with your opinion are somehow anti-American? Americans have more than the single view on this topic than you and Thiranger share. Or are those Americans anti-American too?


Toddy

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This subject is obviously sensitive, judging by the reaction to my OP. It may be an old subject but one still worthy of discussion, surely?


Offline koratwanderer

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guns don't kill people. People kill people.  8)



True, but in most cases it's so much easier to kill someone if you have a gun and are prepared to use it, than with any other weapon!


lozz

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You seem like a really nice guy, Lozz, but sometimes the superficiality and naivety of your comments are just dismaying  :-\

Sorry. Sometimes a lengthy and insightful reply would be wasted. In such cases I like to trivialize the matter while at the same time making a valid ( albeit obvious to those with three digit IQs ) point.

  
« Last Edit: December 09, 2011, 11:00:50 PM by lozz »


lozz

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guns don't kill people. People kill people.  8)



True, but in most cases it's so much easier to kill someone if you have a gun and are prepared to use it, than with any other weapon!

Interesting observation. I can't say if it's easier but I will agree that it certainly is the weapon of choice in the USA.  

The following table on the link below shows the number and percent of murder victims in the United States by the cause of death. Weapons used or cause of death include guns, stabbing, blunt objects, strangulation, arson, and more.

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004888.html


Another Source states that the .22 and .38 are the preferred calibers of choice. 


Offline Anton

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guns don't kill people. People kill people.  8)
True, but in most cases it's so much easier to kill someone if you have a gun and are prepared to use it, than with any other weapon!
Interesting observation. I can't say if it's easier...

You can't say if it's easier?!  :D   Does it require a 3-digit IQ?   ;)

Those weapons are conceived since the start to make killing as easy and quick and serial as possible... Just like in the movies. Oooh yesss.
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Offline Bear

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Let me also clarify my post's: I am also unhappy with the lost of lives and mony spent fighting other countries wars. We are asked to get envolved in many other countries wars because they think we will save them all, and they will become rich with $$$$ to help recover from thier hardship, they always need billions in aid which we are to quick to give them. I also believe we should mind our own buiness in a lot of these conflicts, as when we were ask by england to be involved more in Egypt and we declind. A lot of posters only pick up on things that happn in the US and other countries will relate to the US in a negative way. All countries have their problems. Post do not have to stated in a condensending way to certin countries or people. I am sure most of you would defend your country if it was being belittled by someone. I am sorry if I offended anyone as that was not my intent. Just being me.   Bear
 
If you want to make the world a better place take a look at yourself and then make a change.


Offline Bear

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Lozz you make my point where are the stats for other countries? why only the US ?what % were illegal wepons?, most states have gun laws, which staes were the stats from? how does it break down? Nevada has strick gun laws, and very strick to be able to carry a gun, I am willing to bet most of the killings were from people who would have killed someone, laws or no laws By the way I have a 22, 38x2, and 45x2 in the US, not here, but I am going to apply for a gun permit here.  Bear
If you want to make the world a better place take a look at yourself and then make a change.


Offline Anton

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I am sure most of you would defend your country if it was being belittled by someone.

Bear, you are right and it goes to your credit to defend your country. But frankly, I don't see who is "belittling" your country here. We are talking about a particular matter as laid out in the OP. Nothing to do with the past and current US foreign policy, either. It is true I wrote Americans are not as free as they think they are, but I wrote it referring in particular in relation to this matter (powerful arms industry lobbies) - although I am personally convinced the observation can apply to many other fields, too.

I think that defending your country is done better when you try to keep as much as possible objective on facts. Now, with all what we hear about school shootings and massacres and similar episodes in the USA, much more frequently than in any other country of the world, is it normal to wonder what the hell is going on there? Isn't it rather you and those who think like you, who are belittling something here?

PS From Witkionary: Belittle = To knowingly say that something is smaller or less important than it actually is
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PYB

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Bear

Just out of interest, which countries have asked the USA admin for assistance in there struggles in there countries, I was always under the impression the US have just gone and helped nations that did not even ask, as long as there was something the US admin, where going to get back in return.??

I think your right there are many people Anti American Admin, though not against its citizens, hardly there fault your country wished to police the world.

I look at my own Govt(UK) and see how they have abused many countries in the past, and i not defend them in anyway.


Toddy

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Wiki tells me that the murder rate per capita (doesn't specify how the murder was carried out) is highest in Africa followed by Caribbean, Americas, Eastern Europe, North America, Central Asia, Oceania, Asia and Western Europe.


Toddy

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Let me also clarify my post's: I am also unhappy with the lost of lives and mony spent fighting other countries wars. We are asked to get envolved in many other countries wars because they think we will save them all, and they will become rich with $$$$ to help recover from thier hardship, they always need billions in aid which we are to quick to give them. I also believe we should mind our own buiness in a lot of these conflicts, as when we were ask by england to be involved more in Egypt and we declind. A lot of posters only pick up on things that happn in the US and other countries will relate to the US in a negative way. All countries have their problems. Post do not have to stated in a condensending way to certin countries or people. I am sure most of you would defend your country if it was being belittled by someone. I am sorry if I offended anyone as that was not my intent. Just being me.   Bear
  

I wasn't aware of any UK and/or USA military involvement in the recent Egypt "revolution". I was in Cairo at the time. Do you mean Libya, Bear?
« Last Edit: December 09, 2011, 10:35:30 PM by Toddy »


Offline Alfie

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Let's have a vote.  ;D

Should the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution be amended to take away the right to own and carry arms?


lozz

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Lozz you make my point where are the stats for other countries? why only the US ?what % were illegal wepons?, most states have gun laws, which staes were the stats from? how does it break down? Nevada has strick gun laws, and very strick to be able to carry a gun, I am willing to bet most of the killings were from people who would have killed someone, laws or no laws By the way I have a 22, 38x2, and 45x2 in the US, not here, but I am going to apply for a gun permit here.  Bear

Post relates to US so quoted US stats. But if its of interest...

Quote
The use of a "sharp weapon" led to the deaths of 167 boys and men and 69 girls and women in the year ending April 2005.

A knife is the most common murder weapon and was used in 29 per cent of homicides in England and Wales last year. By contrast a gun is used only about nine per cent of homicides in England and Wales. There were 77 case last year out of a total of 820 homicides.

While the total number of fatal stabbings has remained fairly constant over the past decade, with 231 in 1994 and 236 in 2004, the carrying of knives by young people is on the increase. Four per cent of people aged 10 to 25 carried a knife in the last 12 months for protection, for use in crimes or in case they got into a fight, according to Home Office research. Less than one per cent said they had carried a gun.