'WOKE', 'CANCEL' & 'VIRTUE SIGNALLING'

[Fadang]

Am I any the wiser?  No, not much!

Perhaps, but you've done us all a service by exploring the historical origins of the use of the verb "woke" as an adjective and how the meaning (as an adjective) has been co-opted  to serve as a pejorative against so-called "social justice warriors".

In the end, it's just another non-argument (name calling) used by people not clever enough to devise a real argument of their own. (Calling Trump a "Nazi" is just as worthless.)

[caller]

The term has also been used by some conservatives as an insult against progressive values

But you didn't question this? This is another misnomer. As who decides and agrees on what are 'progressive' values, or aren't? No-one has ever asked me. In reality, it's the same as those of a 'woke' tendency in my view, and is often decided by a small group of unelected souls, with an agenda, who have absolutely no intention of being inclusive, by listening to others views and attitudes. But rather seek to impose their own personal views and opinons, just as with LGTB groups, by well, tyranny, really. Probably too strong a word, but you get my gist, as God help you if you go public with diasagreeing with them. 

[Roger]

Thanks Hector,

Re. this ". . . people now use the term as an attack against cancel culture, political correctness and racial justice initiatives." Being against racial justice initiatives would surely be racist ?

I think this comes closest : "A new Ipsos Poll released recently found that 56% of Americans said woke means "to be informed, educated on, and aware of social injustices."

I'd develop that further to say 'woke' means "to be informed and aware of social differences, to have an overly and energetic perception of social differences and to be overly and energetically concerned to compensate and correct perceived social differences for the minority".

Fadang thanks for your reply, but re. this : "In the end, it's just another non-argument (name calling)". Sorry but in my opinion, it's MUCH MUCH more serious than that and I feel that particularly atm as awareness grows of what has already become entrenched in our Schools re. matters of gender.

Here's Keir Starmer trying to stand up to Labour's 'woke' including this revelation : "Repeatedly asked by the Sunday Times about whether it was ­possible for a woman to have a penis, he said: “For 99.9% of women, it is ­completely biological … and, of course, they haven’t got a penis.”    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/apr/01/turning-trans-issues-into-a-toxic-divide-doesnt-help-says-keir-starmer

[Roger]

Caller - I think Hector is just presenting part of the debate with that bit you quote.

OTHERWISE - I agree with every word of your post : "No-one has ever asked me. In reality, it's the same as those of a 'woke' tendency in my view, and is often decided by a small group of unelected souls, with an agenda, who have absolutely no intention of being inclusive, by listening to others views and attitudes. But rather seek to impose their own personal views and opinons, just as with LGTB groups, by well, tyranny, really. Probably too strong a word, but you get my gist, as God help you if you go public with diasagreeing with them."

It's worth the bloody bold. Cheers 

[Roger]

Beam me up Scottie        https://www.telegraph.co.uk/columnists/2023/04/06/nike-dylan-mulvaney-instagram-model-clothes/

"Why is a man modelling the new Nike bra, grandma? Why is that bloke advertising the new women’s collection at Benetton, grandma? Ha! You may as well ask why that topless young Burberry model has had her breasts surgically removed? Because here’s the thing; the fetishisation of the few at the expense of the many is insane, insulting and an act (I hope) of commercial suicide that will release the pendulum to swing back and whack the wokerati right in their pronouns."

"Once upon a time there was an expression “the man on the Clapham omnibus”. It meant a “reasonable person”, one whose views broadly converged with those in the rest of society. The thing was, the hypothetical man on the Clapham omnibus was a reliable bellwether of public sentiment. He didn’t nurse chippy notions about oppressive heteronormativity or suggest in sex education lessons that seven-year-olds could be “mixed berry gender fluid muffins” as happens in Wales."

All aboard ? 

[Fadang]

As I see it the people accused of being woke are simply people trying their best to do the right thing. At times, over the top. But, IMHO, it's about time.

That's why I'll "stay woke forever".

[Roger]

Hi Fadang and thanks for your thoughts.

My response is if its 'over the top', how can it be the right thing ?

And if it's 'over the top', why is it about time ?

Sorry don't get it . . .

Perhaps you could relate your comment to something specific in the thread - say Nike bras, trans men now women competing in women's athletics or say, drag queens lecturing young children about there being 83 genders ? You know, give us something a bit less vague to chew on. ATB

[Hector]

In my view the person who made this 'hate crime' complaint and was so distressed at seeing the dolls is suffering from the sort of 'wokery' that most of us seem to be decrying.  As for the Essex police's reaction, I agree whole-heartedly with Ms Braverman's comments (and I never though I'd say that!).
Golliwog Doll Seizure by Essex Police from Pub.
Police took several golliwog dolls from the White Hart Inn in Grays last week after receiving a hate crime complaint on 24 February. The dolls, based on 18th century minstrels, are now considered to be racist caricatures. Owner Benice Ryley said she "can't see any harm" and that the 30 or so dolls had been donated over the years by her aunt and the pub's customers and were part of her childhood history.
Police said an investigation was ongoing after a "member of the public reported being distressed after attending a venue off Argent Street" - where the pub is located.
A Home Office source told Sky News Suella Braverman regards it as a waste of police resources. "The Home Secretary's views have now been made very plain to Essex Police so they're under no illusions. Police forces should not be getting involved in this kind of nonsense," they said. "It's about tackling anti-social behaviour, stopping violence, attending burglaries and catching criminals - not seizing dolls."
Mrs Ryley's husband is set to be questioned when he returns from abroad but no one has been arrested or charged.

[Roger]

Hi Hector - I more or less agree with you there. Also I remember moons ago being seriously miffed when the Golli dropped off my marmalade label. However, in the events you recount, there is maybe a deliberate attempt to play on a point ?

I was also simply confused about the ditching of the 'Black and White Minstrel Show'.

If we observe a difference and have some fun with it - it doesn't mean we don't love 'em 

Change of subject - Scotland under the SNP has gone, simply, mad   

"A male GP has been prevented from donating blood to the Scottish NHS after he refused to confirm whether or not he was pregnant. Steffen McAndrew, who works in Prestwick, South Ayrshire, said he had been turned away from a blood donation centre in nearby Ayr after he refused to answer a “bonkers” question about if he was carrying a baby."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/04/13/scotland-nhs-male-blood-donor-turned-away-pregnant/?

My sweet Lord   

[jivvy]

Definition of woke

[Roger]

Cheers Jivvy.

But, things having moved on, I am not sure, as an example, if you agree, or not, with a male Scottish Doctor being refused his wish to donate blood, because he will not confirm that he is not pregnant 

IMO that is madness, of the woke culture, as is widely understood. Madness 

With respect, what do you think about the point ? ATB



 

[jivvy]

Cheers Jivvy.

But, things having moved on, I am not sure, as an example, if you agree, or not, with a male Scottish Doctor being refused his wish to donate blood, because he will not confirm that he is not pregnant 

IMO that is madness, of the woke culture, as is widely understood. Madness 

With respect, what do you think about the point ? ATB

I saw that in the news!!
Sheer and utter stupidity on the part of the relevent authorities

[Roger]

Thanks Jivvy - its the Scottish NHS that runs the blood doning - whether the same question is asked across the NHS UK I've no idea - Scotland does seem to be leading the way with 'gender' hype.

The extent to which all this has been accepted by organisations of such status is alarming, to say the least. ATB

[Roger]

As Budweiser and Nike count the  costs having used a 'trans star' in their adverts, back to Earth in the UK, this madness still propounds itself :-

"A teacher claims she was left 'humiliated' after being ordered to apologise to 11-year-olds at a private girls' school – for calling them girls. Bosses at the £20,000-a-year school told the woman to deliver the mea culpa after her class complained that she had said 'good afternoon, girls' at the start of a lesson, The Mail on Sunday can reveal. After being told by the pupils that 'not everyone here identifies as female', she arrived in class the following day to find they had pointedly written their names and pronouns on the board, including one who used they/them." https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11976891/Female-teacher-forced-apologise-saying-Good-afternoon-girls.html

Better news here in the 'uncancelling' of the heroic J K Rowling - fantastic, what a great Woman she is!

" . . . . she has been vilified by transgender activists and parts of the media for her comments on gender and women’s rights, including her calls for women-only spaces to be reserved for biological women only.

Her forthright views have put her at odds with Harry Potter film stars Daniel Radcliffe and Emma Watson – who argue “trans women are women” – and triggered a bitter backlash from people who were previously adoring fans. By her own account, Rowling has faced a barrage of abuse while critics have gleefully boasted of burning her books and sent the author threats of violence."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/04/15/jk-rowling-transgender-views-uncancelled/

OMG

[jivvy]

Jeeves and Wooster books have been rewritten to remove prose by PG Wodehouse deemed “unacceptable” by publishers, the Telegraph can reveal.

Original passages in the comic novels have been purged or reworked for new editions issued by Penguin Random House.

Trigger warnings have also been added to revised editions telling would-be Wodehouse readers that his themes and characters may be “outdated”.

One warning states that the writer’s prose has been altered because it was judged to be “unacceptable” by Penguin, a publishing house which enlists the services of sensitivity readers.

The disclaimer printed on the opening pages of the 2023 reissue of Thank you, Jeeves states:  “Please be aware that this book was published in the 1930s and contains language, themes and characterisations which you may find outdated.

“In the present edition we have sought to edit, minimally, words that we regard as unacceptable to present-day readers.”

The warning adds that the changes “do not affect the story” of the novel, which is the first full-length work to feature the famed comic creations of idle gentleman Bertie Wooster and his resourceful valet Reginald Jeeves, a pair portrayed by Hugh Laurie and Stephen Fry in a 1990s ITV adaptation.

[Roger]

Yes Jivvy - that's another can of 'woke' worms   

It's common to read of books in the UK being 'revised' to meet the demands of 'woke' approval - all the way down to dear old Enid Blyton    

My youngest Son lives in Florida and brought this to my attention  https://pen.org/florida-book-bans-not-a-hoax/
Something to do Mr Ron De Santis I believe . . . .

It's frightening how deep this stuff has permeated - you've seen of road names being changed I guess AND today, I read that the Brecon Beacons are to be renamed because wood burning beacons caused pollution of course.

It really is all bloody nonsense   

[Hector]

".....AND today, I read that the Brecon Beacons are to be renamed because wood burning beacons caused pollution of course.
Not strictly true Roger.  The Brecon Beacons are reverting to their old Welsh name Bannau (peaks in English) Bryncheiniog – to be known as Bannau, although it is accepted that people from outside Wales will continue to use the name Brecon for a long time.  There is no evidence to suggest that these hills were in any was used as signalling peaks  - they're in the wrong place for that anyway.
As someone who has carried telegraph poles for walkies around the Brecon Beacons (a while back!) I can assure you that the 'brutal and licentious' had a great many exceedingly impolite names for them.
"It really is all bloody nonsense"   Agreed! 

[sfs]

And as a Weshman I can assure you Hector that the vast majority of people living in Wales will continue to call them the Brecon Beacons too. Agree with both you and Roger it is a complete and utter nonesense and no doubt will cost a bloody fortune.

[Roger]

Cheers for that Hector - in younger days I also knew the Beacons a little. The Chelsea Caving Club had a cottage near the Ogof Agan Alwed cave system - disappearing 9 miles under the mountains - getting through boulder chokes and sumping too !!  Long time ago !

Cheers SFS - the DT today : "The public will reject the Brecon Beacons name change, Downing Street said on Monday after the rebrand prompted a far-reaching backlash. Officials responsible for the South Wales park  announced on Monday that it would be renamed the “Bannau Brycheiniog” National Park because the symbol of a carbon-emitting beacon goes against its efforts to fight climate change."

Hooray for that   

And hooray for this -

"Single-sex schools will not be forced to accommodate transgender pupils under new government guidelines set to be issued within weeks. Head teachers of girls’ schools will be told they can reject pupils who are legally male but identify as female, without fear of legal action. The same rules will apply for boys’ schools receiving applications from girls who identify as male.

School leaders will also be told they can refuse to use different pronouns demanded by a pupil, it is understood.
It comes after school leaders and governors met lawyers in recent weeks to discuss fears they could be at risk of discrimination claims from parents of trans-identified pupils if they refused to accommodate them.

A Department for Education source said: “Single-sex schools can refuse to admit pupils of the other legal sex regardless of whether the child is questioning their gender.” Schools will be reassured that they will not be breaching the Equality Act 2010 if they do so. Teachers will not be required to call children by their preferred pronouns, the source said. There is no suggestion that a child who is questioning their gender identity would be forced to leave a single-sex school."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/04/17/single-sex-schools-can-reject-transgender-pupils/

Is the 'woke' tide turning - maybe so 

[Fadang]

I can see that there's no room for me here.

Bye, folks.