Chilcott and Iraq - Tony Blair

[Roger]

All credit to Sir John as we finally get the Chilcott Report which has been much delayed by the process of answering pleas from those with 'reputations' to defend. Like Blair.

I actually feel quite sad for Tony Blair. Watching him fall apart over the years since 2003 and despite his frantic pleas and wriggling now, I have long held the view that, for all he says, this is a Man who KNOWS what he has done - you can see it in his tortured face. The pathetic pleas on TV yesterday were truly embarrassing to watch. What a downfall for Blair after such an impressive beginning when he first led the Labour Party.

The run up to the 2003 Iraq War had me climbing the wall daily as I watched then the obvious lies and manipulation unfolding. But despite all evidence to the contrary - it happened. Because of Blair. And now he can try to convince us he acted in good faith, but at heart he knows a better truth.

Attaching himself 'whatever' to the swaggering Bush, George Bush 2, of 'he tried to kill my Daddy' mentality, (re Saddam), Tony Blair has fallen from great heights. But no doubt there will still be much sympathy for Blair in the USA, perceived as a good 'friend'.

Sad as it is to see anyone's downfall, even Blair, it is the people whose lives were forever altered by death and injury who took the weight of this Bush/Blair folly. Iraq as a Nation looks wrecked. Countless hundreds of thousands have died and been injured and countless hundreds of thousands of Families are saddened forever. Irag may not be able to recover even in a hundred years to any sort of stability.

Iraq is a broken Nation, Blair a broken Man. 'WMD's'. 'Attack on the UK in 45 minutes'. Ridiculous. Shame on you Blair.

The Families of UK servicemen try to fight for Justice in the Courts now - I hope they get Justice. But it won't bring their loved ones back.

As Iraq suffers endlessly, the day before Chilcott is published, a terrorist bombing in Baghdad kills more than all the UK servicemen killed in the 2003 War, in just one moment. Horror indeed. And apparently, horror without end.

[Roger]

Despite a pretty damning Chilcott Report, Blair seems to have no humility and I fear we have not seen the end of him in British politics. As Labour heads to disaster with Corbyn at the helm who knows where and when he might get involved.
A very persuasive speaker and IMO, still a danger to democracy.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/nov/02/tony-blair-psychological-dominance-key-in-uk-joining-iraq-war-says-chilcot

[caller]

I think there is quite a lot of assumptions on Chilcotts part and I suspect a few senior people from Labour at that time aren't talking much now as they all seek to divert any blame. I don't buy senior politicians such as those mentioned being cowed by Blair in the way implied. I just can't see that. It's worth remembering that Chilcott has cleared Blair of lying to the British people and that's the most important thing. I don't think Blair is a danger to democracy in any way, shape or form. I'd prefer his to stay out of politics though, especially Brexit.

[Roger]

Hi Caller. Thanks for your view.
Blair gave his first undertaking to go to war without disclosing such to Parliament or the Cabinet. Chilcott says there was no imminent threat from Iraq at the time when Blair swayed Parliament with the 45 minutes taunt and the dodgy dossier. 'Sofa' government reigned apparently. Blair 'was not constrained by facts'.
Government Ministers are nearly always dependent on the PM's patronage for their positions. I hope Blair stays out of politics too !
However with Labour ailing, the temptation will be strong......
ATB

[caller]

Government Ministers are nearly always dependent on the PM's patronage for their positions.

And the best politicians have principals and Straw has been fairly discredited since. I wouldn't trust a word that came out of his mouth. Robin Cook felt so strongly about the decision to go to war against Iraq, he resigned from the cabinet. Others could have done the same, if they truly held such principles, rather than blaming Blairs forceful personality. Thanks God those that were 'cowed' are no longer in a position to make any decisions.

[Roger]

Yes Robin Cook - sadly missed - he made some great speeches in Parliament against the Iraq war - I regarded him as a true 'Hero' of his time. It was very sad that he suddenly died.
And Claire Short of course. At the Chilcott Inquiry she accused Tony Blair of repeatedly deceiving MP's.

[Alfie]

Well, I have to say that for someone who wrote so much and is apparently highly regarded, he fails at seeking the "truth" and seems to prefer his own opinion or interpretation rather than dig a little deeper to get the fact.

Referring to the evidence given to his inquiry, Chilcot said he recalled asking the then foreign secretary, Jack Straw, why the cabinet had not “provided more of a challenge” to Blair or demanded more information.

“The answer that came back was that Tony Blair had, as leader of the opposition and in government, rescued his party from a dire predicament. I had the sense from Straw’s answer that he had achieved a personal and political dominance, a sheer psychological dominance.

“He [Blair] had been right. Was he not right this time? That’s what I took from Mr Straw’s evidence.”

Surely, he should have demanded more information from Straw on exactly what he meant rather than just interpret a poor response from Straw.

[Roger]

Alfie - In fairness to Chilcott and the other Members of the Enquiry, we should note that there were many 100's of pages of evidence from Jack Straw - I've just been through one section with 160 !
Remember the context of these latest comments - Chilcott was just summarising matters for a Parliamentary Committee.

[Roger]

I watched today an American movie about troops returning from the Iraq war, 'Home for the Brave' - this quotation appeared as the sub-titles began . . .

''Wars begin where you will, but they do not end where you please''.

Neat and true. That was Machiavelli if I remember rightly. Which brings me to this interesting site I found while trying to check up !

http://famous-quotations.com/search.asp?keyword=machiavelli&w1=qz&bl=all&hl=1&page=2

[Roger]

On the 20th anniversary of the 2nd Iraq war, I noticed this video of Robin Cook's 2003 speech - almost moving himself to tears (and me too) https://youtu.be/T9CqiiI2Irg

Richard Armitage, Deputy Secretary of State under George Bush 2nd, talking on The World Tonight, https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001k7t1 (14 minutes in) describes the 'biggest blunder since Vietnam' driven by fear after 9/11, hubris and messianic views in the administration.

Blair is still the same vomit inducing toadie - I wonder how he sleeps at night ?

[caller]

Blair is still the same vomit inducing toadie - I wonder how he sleeps at night ?

Counting his money.

One of the things Blair feared was betrayal by his ministers and others in the party - and by Brown of course. Its one of the reasons he changed ministers so frequently. Which really affected the day to day, behind the scenes, everyday work of Government. It was a paranoia that ultimately sealed his fate and his effectiveness as PM. There was such high hopes for Blair when he came to power, absolutely trouncing the Tories. Ultimately, it was a wasted opportunity to reset the way the UK was run.

[Roger]

Caller - "counting his money" - of course that's it !   

"There were such high hopes for Blair when he came to power" - indeed so and being a bit of a lefty myself sometimes, my hopes really were sky high.

What a shit Blair turned out to be. I was literally climbing the wall for months before the war started - the direction was obvious