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High-speed train plan

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Online KiwiCanadian

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Agreed Anton,

What I see here is the development of a container port at Rayong, then a good rail system thru to the Lao border at  Nong Khai, less mountains to go thru and if the loading gauge is the same as North America then you can double stack the containers that way you get more on one train at a time. It will be interesting to see where these tracks will go through Maung Nakhonratchasima????

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Online Pompui

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I think I read somewhere that the station for the high speed line would be at the shunting yard near the Pandajara hotel in the east of the city.
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Online dereklev

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I think I read somewhere that the station for the high speed line would be at the shunting yard near the Pandajara hotel in the east of the city.

I have heard that too. There is certainly plenty of land to build on.

The downside to that site is the roads in the area are already gridlocked for most of the day.

Perhaps they have budgeted for road improvements in their budget ???
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Online KiwiCanadian

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Ok you say there is plenty of land for a standard gauge track 1.435m (4' 81/2").
What about the double tracking of the meter gauge line that I believe is scheduled for this region. This is now doubled the land required which in some parts of the city is very tight on the existing single track.
Now add the 1.435m "High Speed" track and loading gauge requirements and see if there is any land available for this? and looking at what is available on the net it would suggest that this too will be double track, so a lot of land will be required to add the new tracks.
To me it does not make sense to have the meter gauge station 2 km from the standard gauge station how do you transfer from one type of train to another? tuk tuk is NOT an option.

References:
track Gauge: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Track_gauge
Loading Guage: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loading_gauge   (this is the overall height and width allowed on the line)
Kunming to Singapore Rialway: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunming%E2%80%93Singapore_Railway

Just trying to get the big picture here, so much has been said and probably not much detail has been thought through to the end yet.
My $0.02 worth.

KiwiCanadian.
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Online Pompui

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Ok you say there is plenty of land for a standard gauge track 1.435m (4' 81/2").
What about the double tracking of the meter gauge line that I believe is scheduled for this region. This is now doubled the land required which in some parts of the city is very tight on the existing single track.
Now add the 1.435m "High Speed" track and loading gauge requirements and see if there is any land available for this? and looking at what is available on the net it would suggest that this too will be double track, so a lot of land will be required to add the new tracks.
To me it does not make sense to have the meter gauge station 2 km from the standard gauge station how do you transfer from one type of train to another? tuk tuk is NOT an option.

References:
track Gauge: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Track_gauge
Loading Guage: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loading_gauge   (this is the overall height and width allowed on the line)
Kunming to Singapore Rialway: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunming%E2%80%93Singapore_Railway

Just trying to get the big picture here, so much has been said and probably not much detail has been thought through to the end yet.
My $0.02 worth.

KiwiCanadian.


TIT. How long does it take to transfer between Swampy and Don Muang? The proposed new station is already a small station so transferring from a high speed train to a local train shouldn't be a problem.
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Offline Newshound

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Dual-track trains to get China loan - Beijing to be repaid in Thai rice and rubber

China is to loan Thailand cash to construct three dual-track railways as part of a government-to-government deal to boost regional transport links.

The agreement was made at a full-delegation meeting led by Chinese Premier Li Keqiang and Thai Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha. The meeting followed bilateral talks with Chinese President Xi Jinping on Sunday.

Gen Prayut said Tuesday at the Apec summit in Beijing that the project will cover three routes — Bangkok-Nong Khai, Bangkok-Map Ta Phut and Kaeng Khoi-Map Ta Phut.

The new tracks will allow better transportation from the Northeast to industrial areas in Rayong and will be a good start in developing links between Thailand, Asean and China, he said. They will accommodate mid-speed trains at first but could eventually be used for high-speed services.

The Chinese government will provide a loan to Thailand to allow the development of the lines. Under the arrangement, Thailand will be able to repay the investment costs to China with rubber and rice. Exact details of the "soft loan" arrangement are yet to be worked out.

"We have agreed to build the dual-track rail routes using 1.435-metre standard gauge to improve transport connectivity," Gen Prayut said. "China expressed a readiness to support the construction."

"If we don't start construction now, it will prove an obstacle to transport in the future. We have to make a decisive move, otherwise transport development will be delayed and the cost of the project will increase."

Gen Prayut said the government is holding negotiations on plans to develop several rail routes, but the agreement with China is being made under a "transparent" government-to-government deal, without the involvement of private companies.

The majority of planned dual-track railway development in the country is set to involve one-metre wide tracks, to match existing train lines. But one-metre dual tracks can only accommodate trains at speeds of up to 160kph.

The 1.435-metre standard-gauge tracks that China will help develop could serve trains at speeds of up to 250 kph, although feasibility studies must be carried out to confirm this, Gen Prayut said. "We will proceed with dual-track railways and mid-speed trains at first," he said. "This will be a New Year's present for the Thai people in 2015."

Bangkok Post
More here: http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/general/442786/dual-track-trains-to-get-china-loan



Offline Anton

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Sino-Thai railway route on track to start this year

873km line estimated to cost at least B350bn

Published: 16/01/2015 at 06:00 AM
Newspaper section: News
Writer: Amornrat Mahitthirook


Construction of four sections of a double-track rail route under joint development by Thailand and China are to start this year, according to plans announced by Transport Minister ACM Prajin Juntong Thursday.

Two sections are expected to be ready in 2017 and the others in 2018, he said.

The minister was speaking after a preparation meeting for talks with Chinese counterparts scheduled for Tuesday and Wednesday in Bangkok on the joint development of the double-track railways.

Construction of the first two sections — a 133km track from Bangkok to Kaeng Khoi and a 246.5km track between Kaeng Khoi and Map Ta Phut — will begin in September this year, and services on the two sections will begin in December 2017, according to the minister.

The two other sections — a 138.5km track between Kaeng Khoi and Nakhon Ratchasima and a 355km track from Nakhon Ratchasima to Nong Khai — will be built from December this year, and services will commence in March 2018.

The route is divided into four sections to serve quick exploration and design, ACM Prajin said.

The 873km rail project is estimated to cost 350 billion baht. However, he said the sum could change pending the land survey. If new land is needed for the project, land expropriation expenses would rise.

According to ACM Prajin, the Transport Ministry-based administration office governing the project, headed by permanent secretary for transport Soithip Traisuth, is assigned to design rail and signal systems.

It will also explore land, deal with the environmental impact, take care of utilities as well as handle the public relations campaign in a bid to move the project forward smoothly, he said.

The project will kick off on March 1 with officials being sent to explore land where the route is planned to go through, he said.

The minister said the project must run in line with the framework so it will achieve the planned target.

Speaking about the talks with Chinese counterparts next week, ACM Prajin said details of the projects, including the land survey, construction plans and the time frame for each job, along with the proportions of domestic and foreign investment, will be made clear.

The minister said 12-15 Thai companies which have experience in various fields are being sought out to take part in the project, while Chinese counterparts will conclude the list of developers from five Chinese state enterprises.

The firms will be weighed up and selected to proceed with the project, he said, adding that the conclusion of the matter will be known at a third meeting on Feb 25-27.

Thailand and China last month also signed an agreement to construct the 734km Nong Khai-Nakhon Ratchasima-Kaeng Khoi-Map Ta Phut rail line and a 133km track from Kaeng Khoi to Bangkok.

Deputy Transport Minister Arkhom Termpittayapaisith said the first meeting will pave the way for the establishment of a joint steering committee, which will lay out the schedule of work and designs and conduct a project expenses appraisal.

He noted that train carriage technology will employ the Chinese system, while track design will be made to comply with the Thai topography since it may be necessary for the sections to go through mountain tunnels.

The first talks could also touch upon human resources development and technology sharing on railway construction and operation.

Mr Arkhom said a sub-committee assigned to make decisions on finance sources and type of investment will have to conduct a study to find the most suitable type of investment and method for the optimum benefit of the country.

The sub-committee must conclude laying out the details before the second meeting on Feb 5-7.

Bangkok Post article
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Online KiwiCanadian

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Sino-Thai railway route on track to start this year

He noted that train carriage technology will employ the Chinese system, while track design will be made to comply with the Thai topography since it may be necessary for the sections to go through mountain tunnels.


Well, I can just see a standard gauge track going through a Thai tunnel, what are these muppets thinking. LOL only single containers again. They should be using the North American double stack system, yes this means bigger tunnels. but if you are going to have a marriage for Chinese & Thai technology then I don't think you will even get a High Cube container thru an existing Thai tunnel on a Chinese flat car, let alone a double stack. Just my $0.02 worth.

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Offline Alfie

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It looks like the Thai government has dropped the "High-speed" part of the High-speed train plan!


http://thainews.prd.go.th/centerweb/newsen/NewsDetail?NT01_NewsID=WNECO5806010010011


The Thai government has given assurances that it will carry on with the joint railway construction project with China, saying the Bangkok-Kaeng Khoi-Khorat section will begin to take shape within this year.

Following speculations that the government has canceled its planned cooperation with China on railway development, Deputy Government Spokesperson Maj Gen Sansern Kaewkamnerd has rejected the information as false. Instead, he disclosed that both sides have agreed on the China-proposed construction of a medium-speed system on the Nong Khai-Khorat-Kaeng Khoi-Map Ta Phut section and Kaeng Khoi-Bangkok section, totaling a distance of 873 kilometers.

The Deputy Government Spokesperson said the new system will connect with another Chinese-Lao rail line via Nong Khai and Vientiane. The project is set to be discussed at the fifth meeting of the Thai-Chinese Joint Committee late this month while route survey and cost assessment will be finished within August as scheduled. Construction is expected to commence on the Bangkok-Kaeng Khoi-Khorat section by the end of this year.

Maj Gen Sansern insisted that Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha has a clear policy on forging cooperation with neighboring countries in order to develop the Thai railway system and raise the regional logistics efficiency.
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Offline Alfie

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Medium speed for this rail line is apparently 180 km/h (112 miles per hour).
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Offline Anton

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Medium speed for this rail line is apparently 180 km/h (112 miles per hour).

Bangkok-Korat in 2 hours, not too bad. As long as the ticket price will be "medium speed", too.
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Offline Alfie

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And Korat to Nong Khai in about 2 hours. A day trip to Vientiane could be possible. Breakfast in Korat, lunch in Vientiane, dinner in Korat.
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Offline Newshound

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The double track railway service to the northeastern region of Thailand is expected to commence from 2022 which will help develop Thailand as the logistics hub of ASEAN, an official was quoted in a public forum.

The Vice Governor of Surin Thavorn Kulchoti today presided over the public forum that presented details of the Chira Junction - Ubon Ratchathani double track railroad construction project, allowed the public to voice their opinion.

The project will see the construction of the meter gauge double track railroad that will allow express trains to travel at the speed of 160 kilometres per hour. The project will involve adjustments to the radius of the curves to allow trains to run faster, and the construction of an additional parallel track.

The 309 kilometers railroad section from Chira Junction to Ubon Ratchathani will see the construction of 34 stations throughout the areas of Nakhon Ratchasima, Buriram, Surin, Sisaket, and Ubon Ratchathani provinces. The project is expected to cause minimal environmental effects as the planned route does not cut through water sources, national parks, or any conservation areas.

Once completed, the line can be further extended to the Thailand - Laos border, creating an international commotion route along the East-West Corridor, which will help boost the development in the economy and encourage international trade. This could help Thailand become the logistics hub of the South East Asian region and improve the livelihood of people in the area.

The project construction is expected to be finished in 2021, while the services are set to commence by 2022.

NNT
http://thainews.prd.go.th/centerweb/newsen/NewsDetail?NT01_NewsID=WNECO5806250010016


Offline Alfie

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It seems the financing issue with China could not be resolved.



PM reveals high speed rail link to be funded by Thai government alone

BANGKOK, 24 March 2016 (NNT) – The Prime Minister has explained that the Thai government will be completing the Bangkok-Nakhonratchasima historic high-speed train route on its own with China only contributing to its construction and setting up the route’s technology.

Speaking to the press while inspecting the project, Prime Minister Gen Prayuth Chan-ocha revealed that he recently spoke to Chinese Premier Li Keqiang on the high-speed rail link between Bangkok and Nakhonratchasima. He reportedly told the Chinese premier that Thailand would continue constructing the rail line, which can handle trains traveling up to 250 kilometers per hour, with discussions on investment and funds to commence in July and the project expected to be completed this year.

The prime minister assured that the Ministry of Finance has confirmed the nation has the funds to complete the project, which is considered a historic connection between the central and northeastern regions.

Gen Prayuth affirmed that China would not be investing in the railway and would only be contributing to its construction and technological installations. He said the line would be the first of numerous future railways connecting the regions of the country and allowing existing train routes to be devoted fully to the transport of goods.

NNT
http://thainews.prd.go.th/website_en/news/news_detail/WNPOL5903240010011
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Offline Alfie

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Latest development.

3.5km high-speed train construction to please leaders

16 Jun 2016

WRITER: AMORNRAT MAHITTHIROOK

A Thai-Chinese high-speed train scheme has entered a strange phase where officials of the two countries agreed on Thursday to kick-start the construction of a short section, although they have not settled on the overall project.

The joint committee on the Thai-Chinese train cooperation picked a 3.5km section in tambon Klang Dong of Nakhon Ratchasima's Pak Chong district to be constructed first, while leaving the entire project to further negotiations.

The construction of the short section could begin in September after a bidding call slated for August, Transport Minister Arkhom Termpittayapaisith said. Bidding will be opened to Thai firms and funding could come from domestic sources, he added.

"We will build the short section in line with the aspiration of the leaders of the two countries," said the minister. "Klang Dong station has been selected because there is no land appropriation problem as the land belongs to the State Railway of Thailand."

"The selected area is flat and thus the construction can easily begin," he added.

Klang Dong is one of the six stations planned on the high-speed rail line from Bangkok to Nakhon Ratchasima to be built and funded by Thailand with train technology from China.

The Thai-Chinese train project began last year with high publicity. The government said it would build new tracks for medium-speed trains from Nong Khai to Map Taphut in Rayong and Bangkok. Enthusiam has waned after the two countries failed to settle on several issues including loan conditions offered by China.

After several rounds of negotiations, the Thai government decided in March to replace the project with a 250km high-speed line linking the capital with Nakhon Ratchasima.

The Bangkok-Nakhon Ratchasima project is estimated at 170 billion baht by the government.

Mr Arkhom co-chaired the meeting on Thursday with Wang Xiaotao, the deputy chief of China's National Development and Reform Commission.

Bangkok Post
http://www.bangkokpost.com/business/tourism-and-transport/1011881/3-5km-high-speed-train-construction-to-please-leaders
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Offline Alfie

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Here's the location of Klang Dong: 3.1 miles/5km from the border with Saraburi.

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Offline Anton

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The joint committee on the Thai-Chinese train cooperation picked a 3.5km section

Good for the "joke of the day" thread  ::)
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Offline Alfie

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The joint committee on the Thai-Chinese train cooperation picked a 3.5km section

Good for the "joke of the day" thread  ::)

Yes, it might end up being the only length of high speed train track in Thailand!

It appears they haven't even appropriated all the land for the proposed high speed track. I would have thought that would be the first thing they'd do and that it would be top priority.
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Offline Anton

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It appears they haven't even appropriated all the land for the proposed high speed track. I would have thought that would be the first thing they'd do and that it would be top priority.

No wonder the Chinese have become reluctant about financing it. Maybe they approved this short segment just to test Thai seriousness about the project.
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Offline Alfie

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Construction on 1st leg of BKK-Nakhon Ratchasima rail line to start in Sept

Representatives from Thailand and China have agreed to begin construction of the Bangkok-Nakhon Ratchasima high-speed rail line on the first 3.5-kilometer section within September this year.

Thai Minister of Transport Arkhom Termpittayapaisith has held a discussion with Mr Wang Xiaotao, Vice Chairman of the National Development and Reform Commission of China, as part of the 12th Meeting of the Joint Committee on Railway Cooperation between Thailand and China. The minister affirmed after the meeting that both sides agreed to adhere to the plan to start building the first section of the Bangkok-Nakhon Ratchasima route this September.

The first section, with a distance of 3.5 kilometers, connects Klang Dong Station in Pak Chong district, Nakhon Ratchasima to the province’s border with Saraburi. Financial sources will include the central state budget and domestic loans. Details are set to be submitted to the Cabinet for approval next month.

As for the second portion of the route, stretching 11 kilometers from Pak Chong Station to Khlong Khanan Chit Station, Chinese officials reported that the softness of the soil in the area would be difficult for rail construction. As further discussions will need to be held on the idea of changing the course of the tracks, the deadline for plan submission has been extended from October to November.

The total budget for all four sections of the Bangkok-Nakhon Ratchasima route is estimated at 179 billion baht. China has proposed that Thailand seek loans in the Yuan currency at an interest rate of 3.2 percent, whereas Thailand has expressed its wish to obtain the lowest interest rate available, preferably at 2 percent.

NNT
http://thainews.prd.go.th/website_en/news/news_detail/WNECO5907280010021
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